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*** I do not think any of our personal merit should be in the consideration of the quote and I did not attack this quote because of Keitel. I think the man has probably said a lot of very useful things. However, as I stated before this quote represents a view that upper echelon nazi's were not responsible for the Holocaust, because Hitler said they should kill those people. So my problem is not with Keitel, but with the thought behind the quote. [[User:Denji|Denji]] 12:02, 21 September 2008 (UTC) |
*** I do not think any of our personal merit should be in the consideration of the quote and I did not attack this quote because of Keitel. I think the man has probably said a lot of very useful things. However, as I stated before this quote represents a view that upper echelon nazi's were not responsible for the Holocaust, because Hitler said they should kill those people. So my problem is not with Keitel, but with the thought behind the quote. [[User:Denji|Denji]] 12:02, 21 September 2008 (UTC) |
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**** You are being negligent. You can't rate something a 0 unless it is on the wrong date. Frankly, you are misinterpreting the quote. It wasn't even from the trial. It was from an interview with Leon Goldensohn. It was about Keitel's view of what was the most important quality of a soldier, according to him. This was his response. Initially, it strengthens his resolve and gives potential meaning to the already powerful message. A soldier is a great icon, revered by all countries. The quote was about loyalty and nothing else. Bare in mind that Keitel was responsible for the Oberkommando, which is the highest General unit of army commanders. As he was chief and a very smart war tactician, he truly was honorable as a man and again, the loyalty image here is superb. To remain loyal at times of difficulty is such a powerful act. It's what history has shown difficult (in the cases of Judas against Jesus and Brutus against Caesar. Those are but a few examples of treachery and betrayal in times of difficulty. And the actual unique morality and deep meaning showcased by loyalty is more higher, more magnificent...than any other emotion belonging and pertaining to the image of the soldier elite. That should explain why this quote is so powerful and why I choose it as one of my three favorite quotes of all time as my QOTD suggestions. I mean, I have literally broken down my suggestions of a rating of 4 to a mere 3 quotes for this entire year. This quote means a lot to me. - [[User:Zarbon|Zarbon]] 23:49, 21 September 2008 (UTC) |
**** You are being negligent. You can't rate something a 0 unless it is on the wrong date. Frankly, you are misinterpreting the quote. It wasn't even from the trial. It was from an interview with Leon Goldensohn. It was about Keitel's view of what was the most important quality of a soldier, according to him. This was his response. Initially, it strengthens his resolve and gives potential meaning to the already powerful message. A soldier is a great icon, revered by all countries. The quote was about loyalty and nothing else. Bare in mind that Keitel was responsible for the Oberkommando, which is the highest General unit of army commanders. As he was chief and a very smart war tactician, he truly was honorable as a man and again, the loyalty image here is superb. To remain loyal at times of difficulty is such a powerful act. It's what history has shown difficult (in the cases of Judas against Jesus and Brutus against Caesar. Those are but a few examples of treachery and betrayal in times of difficulty. And the actual unique morality and deep meaning showcased by loyalty is more higher, more magnificent...than any other emotion belonging and pertaining to the image of the soldier elite. That should explain why this quote is so powerful and why I choose it as one of my three favorite quotes of all time as my QOTD suggestions. I mean, I have literally broken down my suggestions of a rating of 4 to a mere 3 quotes for this entire year. This quote means a lot to me. - [[User:Zarbon|Zarbon]] 23:49, 21 September 2008 (UTC) |
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***** This quote is clearly about obedience, which is not to be confused with loyalty. "Loyalty" implies love or affinity for an entity (ie. person or cause), while "obedience" is a duty or obligation that does not necessarily involve any emotion. Judas and Brutus loved Jesus and Caesar, respectively, which made their actions disloyal. The whole point of "Et tu, Brute?" is that Caesar was betrayed by a friend, not some nameless sneaky senator. You gravely misinterpret this quote if you compare disobedient soldiery to Judas and Brutus. I rate this quote 1 [[User Lyle|Lyle]] 23:00, 16 October 2008 (UTC) |
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* 2 [[User:Kalki|Kalki]] 00:22, 21 September 2008 (UTC) |
* 2 [[User:Kalki|Kalki]] 00:22, 21 September 2008 (UTC) |
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* 2 [[User:InvisibleSun|InvisibleSun]] 23:09, 21 September 2008 (UTC) |
* 2 [[User:InvisibleSun|InvisibleSun]] 23:09, 21 September 2008 (UTC) |
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Revision as of 22:01, 16 October 2008
Quotes of the day from previous years:
- 2003
- I never desire to converse with a man who has written more than he has read. ~ Samuel Johnson
- selected by Nanobug
- 2004
- At least two thirds of our miseries spring from human stupidity, human malice and those great motivators and justifiers of malice and stupidity, idealism, dogmatism and proselytizing zeal on behalf of religious or political idols. ~ Aldous Huxley
- selected by Kalki
- 2005
- Delicious autumn! My very soul is wedded to it, and if I were a bird I would fly about the earth seeking the successive autumns. ~ George Eliot
- proposed by Kalki for the first day of Autumn 2005 in Northern Hemisphere
- 2006
- The world is a country which nobody ever yet knew by description; one must travel through it one's self to be acquainted with it. ~ Philip Dormer Stanhope, 4th earl of Chesterfield (born 22 September 1694)
- proposed by InvisibleSun
- 2007
- Just practice good, do good for others, without thinking of making yourself known so that you may gain reward. Really bring benefit to others, gaining nothing for yourself. This is the primary requisite for breaking free of attachments to the Self. ~ Dōgen (died today in 1253)
- proposed by Aphaia
- 2008
- Wear your learning, like your watch, in a private pocket: and do not pull it out and strike it, merely to show that you have one. ~ Philip Dormer Stanhope, 4th earl of Chesterfield
- proposed by InvisibleSun
- 2009
Suggestions
Why sir, there is the probability that you will soon be able to tax it. – Michael Faraday (born September 22, 1791), answering the Chancellor of the Exchequer who had asked what was the use of electricity.
- 4. David | Talk 21:02, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
- 2 - A good quote; but it would need a line of explanation for context, which would make it less suitable for Quote of the Day - InvisibleSun 19:19, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
- 1 Kalki 16:40, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
- 1 Zarbon 17:44, 22 April 2008 (UTC)
- 2 ~ UDScott 19:45, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
- 1 Waheedone 00:29, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
Advice is seldom welcome; and those who want it the most always like it the least. ~ Philip Dormer Stanhope, 4th earl of Chesterfield (born 22 September 1694)
- 3 InvisibleSun 19:19, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
- 3 Kalki 16:40, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
- 1 Zarbon 17:44, 22 April 2008 (UTC)
- 2 ~ UDScott 19:45, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
- 1 Waheedone 00:29, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
The strong man is strongest when alone. ~ Friedrich Schiller, Wilhelm Tell. (22 September 1499) - Switzerland became an independent state.
- 3 Aphaia 08:22, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
- 3 Kalki 16:40, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
- 3 InvisibleSun 18:11, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
- 1 Zarbon 17:44, 22 April 2008 (UTC)
- 2 ~ UDScott 19:45, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
- 1 Waheedone 00:29, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
Work. Finish. Publish. ~ Michael Faraday (born today in 1791
- 3 Aphaia 08:22, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
- 3 Kalki 16:40, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
- 3 InvisibleSun 18:11, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
- 1 Zarbon 17:44, 22 April 2008 (UTC)
- 2 ~ UDScott 19:45, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
- 1 Waheedone 00:29, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
It isn't right to be obedient only when things go well; it is much harder to be a good, obedient soldier when things go badly and times are hard. Obedience and faith at such time is a virtue. ~ Wilhelm Keitel (born September 22)
- 4 because this to me, is one of my three all-time favorite quotes. I have been waiting all year for this quotation and if a rating of 5 were possible, I would give it to this, since the wait has been rather long. The same goes for only two other selections of mine for this entire year. I have limited my rating of 4 to such an extent (only three quotes as I discussed many months earlier), in the hopes that they will make it this year. This particular quote defines loyalty and discipline and it describes the most important quality of a soldier in times of difficulty. Oh, how I am slave to the beautiful moral image of this quote. Please judge fairly, based upon the actual message of the quote and not who is saying it. I have been waiting a rather long time for this quote. Zarbon 04:03, 18 April 2008 (UTC)
- SOURCE: The Nuremberg Interviews by Leon Goldensohn, Robert Gellately - History - 2004 - Page 166
- 2 ~ UDScott 19:45, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
- 0 Denji The general defense of all defendents at the Neurenberg trials was "Befehl ist Befehl", which comes down to same: shoving away one's responsibility for one's deeds. In the end the judges didn't agree with FM Keitel's view and was executed for the actions which he defends with this quote. The hard times he refers to is WWII, being obedient meant crimes against humanity. Though I respect your feelings towards the moral behind the quote, I disagree to the utmost degree with the meaning Keitel gave to it.
- I don't think a rating of "0" is plausible unless the quotation is on the wrong date. The lowest rating I have given to a quote is 1, unless it was already used. This shouldn't even be taken into account since this person has absolutely no history on wikiquote whatsoever other than right here. Also, the fact that this person ignores the very guideline that we are judging quotations and not people is also dubious. This quote means a lot to me, and I have limited my 4 rating to a mere 3 quotes for the entire year, a rather large difference from prior. - Zarbon 04:11, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
- I do not think any of our personal merit should be in the consideration of the quote and I did not attack this quote because of Keitel. I think the man has probably said a lot of very useful things. However, as I stated before this quote represents a view that upper echelon nazi's were not responsible for the Holocaust, because Hitler said they should kill those people. So my problem is not with Keitel, but with the thought behind the quote. Denji 12:02, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
- You are being negligent. You can't rate something a 0 unless it is on the wrong date. Frankly, you are misinterpreting the quote. It wasn't even from the trial. It was from an interview with Leon Goldensohn. It was about Keitel's view of what was the most important quality of a soldier, according to him. This was his response. Initially, it strengthens his resolve and gives potential meaning to the already powerful message. A soldier is a great icon, revered by all countries. The quote was about loyalty and nothing else. Bare in mind that Keitel was responsible for the Oberkommando, which is the highest General unit of army commanders. As he was chief and a very smart war tactician, he truly was honorable as a man and again, the loyalty image here is superb. To remain loyal at times of difficulty is such a powerful act. It's what history has shown difficult (in the cases of Judas against Jesus and Brutus against Caesar. Those are but a few examples of treachery and betrayal in times of difficulty. And the actual unique morality and deep meaning showcased by loyalty is more higher, more magnificent...than any other emotion belonging and pertaining to the image of the soldier elite. That should explain why this quote is so powerful and why I choose it as one of my three favorite quotes of all time as my QOTD suggestions. I mean, I have literally broken down my suggestions of a rating of 4 to a mere 3 quotes for this entire year. This quote means a lot to me. - Zarbon 23:49, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
- This quote is clearly about obedience, which is not to be confused with loyalty. "Loyalty" implies love or affinity for an entity (ie. person or cause), while "obedience" is a duty or obligation that does not necessarily involve any emotion. Judas and Brutus loved Jesus and Caesar, respectively, which made their actions disloyal. The whole point of "Et tu, Brute?" is that Caesar was betrayed by a friend, not some nameless sneaky senator. You gravely misinterpret this quote if you compare disobedient soldiery to Judas and Brutus. I rate this quote 1 Lyle 23:00, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
- You are being negligent. You can't rate something a 0 unless it is on the wrong date. Frankly, you are misinterpreting the quote. It wasn't even from the trial. It was from an interview with Leon Goldensohn. It was about Keitel's view of what was the most important quality of a soldier, according to him. This was his response. Initially, it strengthens his resolve and gives potential meaning to the already powerful message. A soldier is a great icon, revered by all countries. The quote was about loyalty and nothing else. Bare in mind that Keitel was responsible for the Oberkommando, which is the highest General unit of army commanders. As he was chief and a very smart war tactician, he truly was honorable as a man and again, the loyalty image here is superb. To remain loyal at times of difficulty is such a powerful act. It's what history has shown difficult (in the cases of Judas against Jesus and Brutus against Caesar. Those are but a few examples of treachery and betrayal in times of difficulty. And the actual unique morality and deep meaning showcased by loyalty is more higher, more magnificent...than any other emotion belonging and pertaining to the image of the soldier elite. That should explain why this quote is so powerful and why I choose it as one of my three favorite quotes of all time as my QOTD suggestions. I mean, I have literally broken down my suggestions of a rating of 4 to a mere 3 quotes for this entire year. This quote means a lot to me. - Zarbon 23:49, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
- I do not think any of our personal merit should be in the consideration of the quote and I did not attack this quote because of Keitel. I think the man has probably said a lot of very useful things. However, as I stated before this quote represents a view that upper echelon nazi's were not responsible for the Holocaust, because Hitler said they should kill those people. So my problem is not with Keitel, but with the thought behind the quote. Denji 12:02, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
- I don't think a rating of "0" is plausible unless the quotation is on the wrong date. The lowest rating I have given to a quote is 1, unless it was already used. This shouldn't even be taken into account since this person has absolutely no history on wikiquote whatsoever other than right here. Also, the fact that this person ignores the very guideline that we are judging quotations and not people is also dubious. This quote means a lot to me, and I have limited my 4 rating to a mere 3 quotes for the entire year, a rather large difference from prior. - Zarbon 04:11, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
- 2 Kalki 00:22, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
- 2 InvisibleSun 23:09, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
- 4 Waheedone 00:27, 16 October 2008 (UTC)